http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/display.var.1775574.0.teenagers_chased_and_hit_in_gang_attack.php
It has been suggested the attack may have been motivated by the newspaper article in the Lancashire Telegraph printed the day before which reported that some shopkeepers in Blackburn claimed that Emos and Goths were intimidating
And what about media coverage of Asa Coon a week earlier see School Killing involves "goth"?
This insensitive article which was printed on the same day as the committal of the suspects in the Sophie Lancaster case was originally titled 'Emos and Goths intimidating
Note the young people involved are guilty of no crime as the police comment indicates but are simply assembling in a public place. There was some inaccuracy in the report the description of the group which mentions the fact a number of people in the group had skateboards. This means a considerable number of them are in fact skaters rather than goths or emos as some of the comments on the article make clear.
The paper has now printed a new article on the question which further indicates how reasonable those gathered in
Emos and Goths - 'don't be afraid of us'
The five suspects in the Sophie Lancaster case have been committed for trial in Burnley the preliminary hearing will be held at Preston Crown Court on October 31st, Halloween.
http://www.therossendalefreepress.co.uk/news/s/233/233457_murder_rap_teenagers_in_court.html
Article on the SOPHIE fund and many of the local and world wide tributes to Sophie. Much kudos to all of those involved in organising these.
A closed skatepark has been burnt down arson is involved. Who is responsible? There is some debate about who is responsible. Although it seems some skaters (foolishly) had been breaking into the park to skate they would not have burned down a place they loved. As one comment on the story said:
Does everyone really think that skaters have done this?? Why would they burn down the only good skate facility? Its all the little kids that wear their Nike track suites and tuck their socks into the pants that have done this. everyone needs to open their eyes to the amount of inbred youths in Bolton and stop blaming people who role about on a skateboardThose skaters involved in breaking in certainly hold some responsibility perhaps they broke doors or windows which were later used by the arsonists to gain entry or their use of the park attracted attention to it. Yet their wider points are valid. An examination of the history of the park reveals it collapsed as a commercial venture in September 2006 due to persistent vandalism from local youths not skaters:
The final blow came earlier this month when vandals trashed the premises, ripping out water pipes, tearing doors off hinges and smashing hi-fi equipment.An earlier report Vandals killing skaters' fun park show the level of the problem:
The former owner and local skaters were persecuted and attacked. Now the park is closed an intelligent guess would blame the same local group of vandals for burning what was left. Indeed looking at details of the situation in Bolton reveals some interesting information."But we started running into problems when attendance dropped off because customers were being frightened off by gangs of youths stealing their mobiles, cash, skateboards. There's also only so many times you can replace a smashed window."
At the moment the motivation of the attack is unclear, but it is certainly a situation to watch.A TEENAGER had his ankle broken in several places during a vicious attack at a skatepark.
Detectives believe onlookers may have filmed the 14-year-old being beaten on their mobile phones, as he was attacked at the park off Blindsill Road, New Bury.
An argument among a group of up to 20 youths had turned violent and the youngster was knocked to the ground before being punched and kicked to the body. He is understood to have suffered the break when he was stamped on.
Probably a stoke of misfortune here, rather than active prejudice at work, though one suspects the person who reported the goth may have been either rather naive or had a nasty sense of humour. I mean what kind of jail break involves the escapee staying near the Court House dressed in goth clothes? If he hadn't been a goth would the police have bothered pulling him in?
TULSA, Okla., Oct. 15 (UPI) -- Sheriff's deputies in Tulsa, Okla., said a man who was spotted wearing handcuffs unescorted outside a court house was making a fashion statement.
Deputies were called to the scene outside of Tulsa County (Okla.) Courthouse after a passerby reported a man in handcuffs outside the building was unescorted by police or other authorities, Tulsa World reported Monday.
Sheriff's Sgt. Jody Britt said deputies discovered the man was wearing the handcuffs as part of his gothic fashion ensemble.
"I guess he had one end attached to his arm and the other dangling, which to us looks like he escaped from custody," he told the newspaper.
The man was released after authorities checked that he had no outstanding warrants, Britt said.
"Wearing a set of handcuffs near a courthouse is not exactly the most intelligent thing you could do," he said to the World.
Despite a massive internet campaign to save it Camden Stables Market a central point in the UK's alternative scene has been lost. Iconic shops like Black Rose, and Cyberdog are to go. More than 10,000 people have added their names to an online petition to save it. The massively higher new rents plus the glassy buildings inside will seriously alter the structure of the market and the area. It was wonderful use of Victorian buildings now it will be a souless hell. Rumour has it that the ultimate aim is to push out many of traders and eventually urn some of the area into apartments :
Marilyn Manson at Challenge Stadium | PerthNow
October 14, 2007 12:00pm
Actually he was talking about Asa Coon.MARILYN Manson was one star who was certainly not in town for Telethon.
While a plethora of stars joined forces to raise money for sick children, over at Challenge Stadium Manson and his army of black t-shirt sporting supporters were more concerned with celebrating the seedier side of life. ..
The only mildly controversial statement Manson made was when he declared: "as you know I am responsible for every school shooting that ever happens". His statement was a response to his name being linked to almost every school shooting from the Columbine High School massacre to the recent shooting at SuccessTech Academy in Cleveland.
Loyal Perth fans have been waiting more than 8 years for their goth idol to return after Manson stormed off stage at the Big Day Out back in 1999. Manson was at the start of his performance when he left the stage after being pelted with bottles and cans. This time around Perth punters were far more appreciative of Manson. They were even willing to overlook the poor vocal performance and bad sound mix and the fact that Manson's new band cannot match previous line-ups. But can anyone really hold a candle to the guitar genius of John 5?
A new tragic killing in the United States on October 1oth and once again media coverage sadly highlights items that put subcultures in a bad light. Asa Coon came from a troubled background, faced a life of being bullied, managed to get hold of guns and had been previously been in trouble for violence. Also in a predominately black school he adopted "goth" clothes and liked Marilyn Manson, being nicknamed Jack Black by other pupils said: “He was chubby and short, and he was the only kid in school who dressed like a Goth.”
Guess which element of his background was focused on by some media reports.
On October 12th the highest selling newspaper in the UK The Sun ran this for example:
Gun boy: My god is Marilyn | The Sun |HomePage|News: "A BOY of 14 wounded two schoolmates and two teachers in a gun rampage after boasting he did not believe in God – but instead worshipped rocker Marilyn Manson. Loner Asa Coon – who opened fire with two revolvers at his school before killing himself on Wednesday – had a history of mental problems, US police said yesterday. Days earlier he was suspended for fighting fellow youngsters who objected to his God comments. Doneisha LeVert, 14, said: “He threatened to blow up our school.” Coon, who wore a goth trenchcoat and dog collar, sneaked his weapons past metal detectors at the SuccessTech Academy in Cleveland, Ohio."
"Witnesses described him as a goth with white make-up and black nails – and told how he had chillingly warned his classmates “I’ve got something for you”."
CLEVELAND — Fourteen-year-old Asa H. Coon took abuse, gave abuse, exchanged curses with his mother and said he chose to worship shock rocker Marilyn Manson instead of God. He was the subject of a neglect case when he was 4, and he often went to school looking a mess.
None of that explains why he walked a hallway of his school Wednesday with two guns and started shooting, wounding two students and two teachers before killing himself.
"This kid finally broke," Christina Burns, who volunteered at a school Coon previously attended, said yesterday. "He finally lost his mind."
Coon had been on suspension for a Monday fight when he somehow got into the SuccessTech Academy alternative school. His fellow students said his threats to hurt students last week went unheeded by school officials.
Burns said Coon was intelligent but struggled with school work, unable to focus. He had mood swings, she said. "There was days he was sociable, days where he was shut down, closed in, hated the world," Burns said.
Burns witnessed Coon's troubles with fellow students. She also remembered verbal abuse over his shabby, at times unclean, appearance.
"They picked on him," Burns said. "He didn't have decent clothing. He didn't have decent shoes. He had problems. The other children played on that and tormented him at school."
"Everybody's making him out to be a devil, a demon,' she said, "but nobody knows what was going on with this kid."
Despite 26 security cameras, officials couldn't say yesterday how Coon was able to get into the SuccessTech Academy alternative school. Coon was a new student at the school, but the district has a dossier on past problems. He had mental-health problems, spent time in two juvenile facilities and was suspended from school last year for attempting to harm a student, according to juvenile court records.
The school of about 240 students has metal detectors but none were operating Wednesday. Students said the devices were used only intermittently."
"DR. STEVEN PITT, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: To be sure, Anderson, there are red flags to look like things like depression and anger and familiarity with weapons and fascination with the military. Those are all red flags. But there's an art to this, as much as there is a science. I mean, we can go to schools all around the country and lots of people have those very same characteristics... since Columbine, there has been a real emphasis and a real looking at schools where bullying is taking place. Make no mistake about it. Bullying was underreported at Columbine. I think schools have taken a much more aggressive look at the effect that bullying has on youths and as it relates to their acting out behavior."In the 16 other school related killings in the USA this year no "goths" were involved, though the other killings did often involve people who had been bullied or alienated, had histories of violence and all got access to firearms. Did reports on these other murders discuss the musical preferences of those involved?
Disney cancelled a series of metal gigs back in September.
Machine Head is disturbing The Mouse.
Twice this month, House of Blues concert venues on Disney-owned property — one in Anaheim and one in Orlando — booted long-booked Machine Head concerts just days ahead of the scheduled performances. The Orlando House of Blues also forced death-metal band Cannibal Corpse to change venues.
The entire post is intelligent and well thought out and raises important issues.Machine Head frontman Robb Flynn wrote a guest blog about his views on citizenship and censorship...
I have been on the road touring for over half of my life, 13 years of which have been with Machine Head. This is what we do. Frankly, it’s all we know how to do. And in the 13 years we’ve been touring, we have never experienced the kind of flat-out extortion that we were just privy to. Never did we think that what we just witnessed over the course of the last few weeks would ever be possible, let alone tolerated in this day and age. But as I sit here writing these words to you, we are still in an utter state of shock.About a month ago, we were told that our concert at The House Of Blues in Anaheim, California (which is on Disney property) — after having been on sale for six weeks — was going to be moved on two days notice because Disney had begun silently enacting a blanket policy to eliminate all heavy metal shows from the two House of Blues venues that reside on Disney property. Now, of course, no one would go on record about exactly what Disney’s brand new issue(s) with metal seemed to be (understandably so). But the “unofficial” gist is that metal lyrics were deemed “inflammatory” and metal fans deemed “undesirable.”...
But when a corporation like Disney forces the cancellation of your show because your style of music is “inappropriate,” it really sticks in your craw, especially when you think about what’s playing at the theater right next door. For example, now playing at the Downtown Disney AMC Theater are a number of movies rated “R” for, among other things, “strong sexual content”, “strong horror violence,” “intense sequences of graphic brutal violence,” nudity and drug use. It goes without saying that a heavy metal show is (with the exception of violence) fairly tame by those standards. Hell, even by the oft-assumed worst-case scenarios preached by ignorant conservative groups about “the evils of heavy metal,” the genre still falls well short of offering its fans the sort of influences present in the major motion pictures playing a mere hop, skip and a jump away.
Nevertheless, we here at antiMusic will do our part and we will no longer carry any articles related to anything Disney including Hollywood Records until they stop their censorship. We encourage you to join us in this boycott and refrain from all things Disney. Shouldn't be too hard.
Machine Head, Arch Enemy, Throwdown, Sanctity, Cannibal Corpse, The Black Dahlia Murder, The Red Chord And The Absence, Obituary, Alabama Thunderpussy, Full Blown Chaos And Hemlock have all suffered under the new Disney fascism.
Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold killed 12 people at Columbine High school in 1999. As well ruining the lives of those who lost loved ones they also left an ongoing legacy of fear and mistrust for other people who were nowhere near Columbine. It meant goths and fans of other alternative music were blamed for murders that were no responsibility of theirs and every time the media mention Columbine the connection is frequently repeated. This legacy owes much to poor media reporting.Why did this myth develop? Because inaccurate reports were made just after the attack as this key examination of the events based on the report of Sheriff's investigation makes clear:
Investigators also criticized the media for propagating the myth that the pair were Goths. Apparently it took nothing more than reports of black clothing and eyeliner among the unrelated Trench Coat Mafia for much of the national media to label them Goths. "That became a whole issue for a week," one investigator said. "Marilyn Manson canceled his concert."
ABC's "20/20" aired a particularly ignorant "report" the night after the tragedy, linking the killers to the scene with alarmist messages about Satanism and cults. Aside from the fact that the report completely misrepresented and maligned the movement, neither Marilyn Manson nor the Goths had anything whatsoever to do with the killers, who had nothing but contempt for the music.
The media even got the idea they were part of the Trenchcoat Mafia (some of whom were goths) wrong:
Harris and Klebold are still routinely referred to as belonging to the Trench Coat Mafia. As recently as Wednesday, in a report on Sears' decision to stop selling a trench coat-wearing action figure, CNN Headline News was referring to "the two Trench Coat Mafia teens who were responsible for the Columbine High School massacre last April." But sources unanimously and unequivocally confirm that the group had nothing whatsoever to do with the murders, and very little to do with Harris and Klebold.
Some of the confusion concerning a wider conspiracy lies with premature remarks made by Sheriff John Stone the morning after the massacre. But the department has since ruled out the possibility that the killers were connected with the group of Columbine outsiders known as the Trench Coat Mafia.
"Harris and Klebold were never part of the Trench Coat Mafia," one investigator said. "They were kind of friends of fringe members." Battan scoffed at the notion of any significant association: "They were outcasts in that!"
By the time of the murders, most of the Trench Coat Mafia had graduated or dropped out, and the term was almost an anachronism, investigators explained. That didn't stop a flurry of would-be terrorists from latching onto the name. "Suddenly, there were thousands of Trench Coat Mafia all over the country," Davis said. "I get Internet threats from, like, Iowa that they're the Trench Coat Mafia," Battan laughed. "Well, there is no Trench Coat Mafia!"
That didn't stop anyone associated with the group from being ostracized. They went virtually unseen at the innumerable memorials and grief ceremonies, and some students even threatened "retaliatory" violence should they show their faces in nearby Clement Park, which became the site of impromptu memorials last spring.
It was widely reported that students associated with the group were effectively prohibited from finishing the school year with their peers at Chatfield High School. However, district spokesman Rick Kaufman says it had nothing to do with the Trench Coat Mafia per se. Eighteen students were identified as acquaintances of Harris and Klebold, he said.
They were offered alternatives such as home-based tutoring, "because of the raw emotions, the strong feelings that existed right after the tragedy." "Twelve of the 18 said, 'Thanks but no thanks,' and returned to school," he said. "Six of the 12 accepted the offer. There was only one student who we were not going to allow back to school."
As far as trench coats themselves, Klebold was known to wear one occasionally. However, "No student can recall ever seeing Eric wear a trench coat, other than once, this past fall [1998], other than the day of the shooting," Kaufman said.
Inside the Columbine High investigation Salon.com Sept. 23, 1999
Everything you know about the Littleton killings is wrong. But the truth may be scarier than the myths.
Certainly Harris was a big fan of German Industrial and Techno especially KMFDM and Rammstein which has some cross over with the goth scene, but there is no evidence he had any interest in any more gothic bands. Kebold's favourite music included The Smashing Pumpkins, Orbital, The Chemical Brothers, KMFDM, Nine Inch Nails, and Rammstein. Moreover they did not dress in a goth or any other alternative style, hang round with the goth group in the school and their interests in guns, baseball, and computers were perhaps more significant to them than music. You can see more about Harris's musical interests here Music.Man's greatest fear is chaos. It was unthinkable that these kids did not have a simple black-and-white reason for their actions. And so a scapegoat was needed. I remember hearing the initial reports from Littleton, that Harris and Klebold were wearing makeup and were dressed like Marilyn Manson, whom they obviously must worship, since they were dressed in black. Of course, speculation snowballed into making me the poster boy for everything that is bad in the world. These two idiots weren't wearing makeup, and they weren't dressed like me or like goths. Since Middle America has not heard of the music they did listen to (KMFDM and Rammstein, among others), the media picked something they thought was similar.
Responsible journalists have reported with less publicity that Harris and Klebold were not Marilyn Manson fans -- that they even disliked my music. Even if they were fans, that gives them no excuse, nor does it mean that music is to blame. Did we look for James Huberty's inspiration when he gunned down people at McDonald's? What did Timothy McVeigh like to watch? What about David Koresh, Jim Jones? Do you think entertainment inspired Kip Kinkel, or should we blame the fact that his father bought him the guns he used in the Springfield, Oregon, murders? What inspires Bill Clinton to blow people up in Kosovo? Was it something that Monica Lewinsky said to him? Isn't killing just killing, regardless if it's in Vietnam or Jonesboro, Arkansas? Why do we justify one, just because it seems to be for the right reasons? Should there ever be a right reason? If a kid is old enough to drive a car or buy a gun, isn't he old enough to be held personally responsible for what he does with his car or gun? Or if he's a teenager, should someone else be blamed because he isn't as enlightened as an eighteen-year-old?
Marilyn Manson: Columbine: Whose Fault Is It? : Rolling Stone
In scattered reports from around the country, high school students who dress defiantly, or who are computer lovers, or who qualify in any way as outcasts, say that since the killings in Littleton, Colo., last week, they feel as if they have become perceived not only as different but as threats... The messages pouring in to Mr. Katz have included reports of students being expelled or suspended from school for "antisocial" behavior or sent home to change clothes similar to what the killers wore; of clampdowns by parents on computer use; of increased scrutiny and determined offers of counseling from adults, especially when students say that though they do not condone the shootings, they can understand what motivated them, and of more hostility from other students.
Carey Goldberg " TERROR IN LITTLETON: THE SHUNNED; For Those Who Dress Differently, an Increase in Being Viewed as Abnormal" New York Times - May 1, 1999
In the past twenty years, the Goth subculture has become its own culture, generating many subcultures within itself. I am acquainted with several young people who are part of this. They share my concern at the media's portrayal of Harris and Klebold as Goths. Several have been harassed on the street since the Columbine incident. Yet the truth is that violence is anathema to most Gothic lifestyles. And Nazism is not glorified by Goths. How could it be, my friends ask, when Goths would be among the first persecuted by Nazis today? They fear for younger "quiet freaks" still in high school "who wear black, tint their hair, have multiple piercings, write dark poetry--and aren't ever going to hurt anyone." So do I.Another good article is here:The Columbine Tragedy Countering the Hysteria May 1999
Dark days for Goths Emily Sweeney The Boston GlobeOct. 15, 2004 12:00 AMThe same thing still goes on and on. Through all this Harris and Kebold's evil acts live on tainting the lives of the innocent. Simply check out other reports mentioning Columbine in this blog found here. There is simply no connection between goth and any other form of music and the killings at Columbine. If you are looking for reasons the murders occurred because the teenagers were full of hatred and had easy access to fire arms.
Sixteen-year-old Sonya Feinn usually wears black clothes, thick eyeliner, and dark lipstick. She listens to Sisters of Mercy and Nine Inch Nails. She is accustomed to people glaring at her Gothic-inspired outfits, so she wasn't surprised when journalists described a Marshfield, Mass. teen accused of plotting a school shooting as a Goth.
"I've rarely seen Gothic figures portrayed in a good light in the news, the media, and the movies," Feinn said. "We get such a bad rap."
In middle school, Feinn's classmates called her a "Satan worshiper" because she wore dark clothes. Ironically, Feinn left that public school to attend an all-girls Catholic high school that requires school uniforms. More recently, Feinn's high school classmates gave her friend Mike the nickname "Columbine" because he wears long trenchcoats - an innocuous article of clothing that became synonymous with school shootings five years ago.
Those notorious long coats and the term "Goth" made headlines in 1999 when two Colorado teens attacked their high school, shooting to death students and teachers. Authorities initially described the gunmen as Goths, because they often wore black clothes to school and dubbed themselves "The Trenchcoat Mafia." Media coverage of the Columbine High School massacre thrust Gothic subculture into the national spotlight, and almost overnight the G-word became inextricably linked to school violence, even though the Columbine killers shared no attributes found in the Goth subculture, with the exception of dark clothing...
Life wasn't easy for him and his darkly dressed cohorts at Lexington High. Classmates would call them homophobic slurs and throw empty plastic bottles at their heads. "To be a guy dyeing your hair black and wearing makeup, you were under constant scrutiny by your peers," said Usmani. "You couldn't walk around town with black dyed hair and eyeliner without being profiled by shopping clerks or having a couple of kids try to start with you." Usmani added, "After Columbine, (Goth) kids were put on the spot more than before."
Feinn has grown accustomed to being scrutinized because of her self-expression. She said her outfits usually draw interesting reactions from passersby. She recently walked into a bagel shop in her hometown of Reading and witnessed a young mother try to shade her child's eyes from looking at Feinn's Goth outfit. In middle school, her classmates called her devil worshiper, or referred to her as Satan. "I was treated so badly (in middle school)," Feinn said. "People in this town aren't comfortable with (Goths)."
She finally decided to leave the Reading public schools and attend her high school, where, thanks to the required uniforms, "no one can judge you on what you wear."
[This next article sadly only one of the many exampls of the Columbine goth myth in action. Virtually everything mentioned in this article about Columbine is wrong 6 years after the killings.]
Eerie Parallels Are Seen To Shootings at Columbine
New York Times - Mar 23, 2005He is said to have worn a trench coat and listened to Marilyn Manson, the Goth icon. He expressed his admiration for Hitler on a neo-Nazi Web site. And in the midst of a murderous rampage at his high school, Jeff Weise asked a classmate if he believed in God, then shot him, one student recounted in a local newspaper.
As details begin to emerge about Mr. Weise's shooting spree on an Indian reservation in northern Minnesota, there are eerie echoes of the nation's most infamous school tragedy, six years ago at Columbine High School near Littleton, Colo.
At Columbine, the killers, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, belonged to the ''Trench Coat Mafia'' and loved all things Goth. They sometimes did a Nazi salute while bowling and planned their attack for Hitler's birthday. Before killing one student, witnesses said, one of them held a gun to her temple and asked if she believed in God.
As mentioned before on the Epetition the idea of "Hate Crime" legislation being applied to subcultures arose quite soon after Sophie's death and aroused strong opinions for and against. See the debate at this site: Gothic.net Community - Change the UK Law - Goth Hate Crime - lets try anyway. The points raised against the idea of hate crime legislation for subcultures which are noted below come from there. [Note they are talking about an earlier petition not the UK specific one].
Many points are very good and entirely valid. I think it is very interesting to note the reluctance of many to immeadiately endorse the idea, which you might think from an emotional and purely tribalistic perspective might seem very attractive given the strong feelings Sophie's death aroused. Does this mean goths think too much as some people have suggested? Or that goths actually are as individualistic as they often claim to be? Is dealing with goths like trying to herd cats as I myself have observed?
Whatever you conclude this is why I think it is important to emphasise as well education and awareness - the ideas pursued by the SOPHIE campaign, rather than necessarily wage a battle over whether this a hate crime or not? Trying to reduce negative coverage of subcultures in the media is a key element in this I think.
Some of the key points and ideas mentioned in the debate against the idea of redefining Hate Crime are:
A) subcultures choose to be different unlike gay or racial minorities:
IsolatedReptile: What I said was, it's a fashion thing. Fashion is a choice. If you feel threatened, don't dress that way. It's not a hate crime because you wear black. It's just a crime. It's a hate crime if you are black. You can't help that.B) Where do you draw the line? If Hate laws are extended to some subcultures where does it stop?
Beneath the Shadows: As far as I'm concerned, the only things that should be considered hate crimes are crimes against people who were born certain ways, ie because of sexual orientation or ethnicity. Those people cannot help what they are, so any crimes against them just because they what they are are hate crimes. But just about everything else is a choice.
Don't get me wrong, I still think that it's tragic that someone will get beaten up for how they vote, or what god they worship, or how they dress. But those are all choices.
Captain Stern: What people are proposing here is we be put on the same level as jewish people who have their synagogues burned and covered in swastikas by skinheads, that we get equal protection like blacks who are hung for dating white women , like other minorities who really have had, and still have atrocities forced upon them in todays society.
Althought I'm sure the founders of the movement have nothing but good intentions, goths have by no means suffered as much as the groups above, or any other minoroties who have been targetted in such a manner.
If we try to compare our plight, which so far is limited to a single incident where a group of random yobs beat up a couple goths in the middle of the night, to these other groups, we will look very petty and small.
CptSternn: Every person beaten is a hate crime. If the kids were wearing glasses and a pocket protector, would we include geeks as a hate crime? If they were wearing tie-dyes would we add in hippies? If they were wearing ren-faire outfits, would we protect people in medieval garb as a hate crime?
What if they wore chicken suits and had gotten beaten up? We going to make Disneyland a protected sanctuary for people in cartoon suits?
Every crime is a hate crime. People get beaten for many reasons. Beating someone because of something they cannot change deserves to be a crime enforced but adding every little fashion change to hate crime laws doesn't help us.
CptSternn: It lessens the effect of real hate crime legislation. If everyone goes asking to be included in 'hate crime' laws, in the end they will just raise the penalties for all beatings because everyone wants to be listed as their own group.... I think even trying to get this put into legislation is a bad idea. It makes goths look petty, and ignorant. It also makes real hate crimes look less important, considering we appear to want protection like minorities or foreign nationals, and we are normal people, average citizens, mostly from affluent areas, who merely choose to wear an outfit.
Drake Dun: I think we should just extend hate crimes to cover all types of crime. So then it would be "hate murder", "hate aggravated assault", "hate grand larceny", "hate intentional misrepresentation with intent to defraud in connection with interstate commerce" and so forth. So then, see, they would all have "hate" in front of them, so it would be redundant, and we could drop it, and set all the sentences back to where they were to begin with.E) New laws won't change anything it is a wider social problem:
Then we could erase all record of the entire process, and quietly pretend that we never went through this ludicrous phase of thinking that beating someone up because you don't like their clothes is somehow worse than beating them up for their wallet.
Stephanie: I'm not trying to make light of these situations but you have to be realistic, there are 'twats' out there that commit these crimes regardless of who/what the person is, usually they are bought up with very little discipline/or too much, violence in the home, violence on tv, drug/alcohol problems within the home, the list goes on and on.
'Thugs' know that they will generally get a slap on the wrist whenever a crime is committed and minors know this also, children aren't as innocent as society makes out!!
I understand that your heart is in the right place with wanting to get 'hate' crimes recognised but it would be more constructive to try and get sentences increased, mental/drug/alcohol/social problems looked at as this is where these crimes usually start. We need more information distributed within schools etc.
Sophie remains unburied for legal reasons as the trial approaches. Memorial fund in Sophie’s honour launched by friends and family which aims to fight similar violence. The special fund to be known as S.O.P.H.I.E stands for "S tamp O ut P rejudice H atred (and) I ntolerance E verywhere" aiming to "provide an appropriate memorial; a lasting legacy to raise awareness of the injustice perpetrated against Sophie Lancaster and to work towards a more tolerant, less violent society."
There is now an official Sophie Myspace page :
Sophie Lancaster Memorial Book
http://www.legacy.com/TheRossendaleFreePress/DeathNotices.asp?Page=LifeStory&PersonID=93459606
12 hour Memorial concert was held in Bacup on the weekend with 10 bands. Local football club donates proceedings of match to S.O.P.H.I.E fund. The local townsfolk have really pulled together to express horror at this vicious attack.
POLICE are not expecting to make any further arrests in relation to the attack on Sophie Lancaster and her boyfriend Robert Maltby.
Detective Inspector Dean Holden, who has headed up the investigation from the start, said: 'I have been encouraged by the amount of people who have come forward with information and I am grateful for the positive reporting we have received.
'We have spoken to in excess of 100 people in the course of this inquiry and many of those people were young people and of course there are criteria to interviewing and speaking to young people.
'During the night of 10 August into the early hours of 11 August there were probably 15-20 young people in the park at various times. However, not all of them were present during the attack.
'The park is a meeting place and, during the night, children come and go.
'We are not looking at making any further arrests. I am very grateful for the help we have received and since this incident we have had a lot of support from members of the community and that is good.'
The police originally were looking for a further more people who were present during the attack as well as the 5 already under arrest. The next stage in the court process is October 18th.
October Whitby Gothic Weekend is to be dedicated to Sophie’s honour. She visited there in October 2005 with Rob. A collection organised from numerous local goth nights as well as at
”An information stall will be set up in the Pavilion over the weekend of 26 October where small black ribbon roses will be sold to be worn in her memory, and donations accepted to help pay for a memorial bench and plaque to be installed.”
Contact Martin Oldgoth to contribute to the
http://www.insanitorium.co.uk/news.htm
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Charnel House in
Eccentrik Festival
The Coven (
Dominion in
Faith and the Muse/Beauty of Gemina/Razorblade Kisses gig in
B-Movie in
Dr Fells and Dr Fells Live in
Misery Of Sound- Blackpool 19th October- SCREAMING BANSHEE AIRCREW + PSYDOLL [japan] + PINK HEARSE
Mas -
3 Nov 2007 14:00 The Sir Charles Napier Memorial Concert @ Blackburn
23 Nov 2007 19:00 ’Make A Noise’ punk gig,
24 Nov 2007 19:00 Metal gig night at the Adelphi ,
25 Nov 2007 19:00 Sophie Lancaster Memorial Concert @ St Mary’s Chambers Rawenstall
Jazz night at the Jolly Sailor in Waterfoot on 25 November
This epetition was set up about ten days ago.
“Widen the definition of 'Hate Crime', to include crimes committed against a person or persons, on the basis of their appearance or subcultural interests” Ade Varney
Set up on September the 28th.
Note that petitions held at this site always generate an official response from the Prime Minister’s office when complete. You have to be a British citizen to sign the petition. Please use your real name as this a grave issue and the more real signatures attached to this the more seriously the issue is likely to be considered. The petition currently has 1036 signatures making it the 199th most popular petition on the site out of 8261 live petitions. The Liberal democrat MP for Colchester Bob Russell has already said he will approach the Home Secretary to discuss the issues raised by the attack and the petition.
There has been much online discussion about whether attaching the name hate crime to these type of assaults is in fact valid. Whether or not you agree with the idea of the petition, and of hate crimes in general it should be recognised that this petition does represent a chance to get the government to actually consider the problem of physical attacks on people from alternative subcultures and it can be used to generate media and police interest in the problem. If all that means in practice is that one goth, punk, emo kid or metaler somewhere in the UK gets a more sympathetic hearing from the police next time he/she has been attacked, I think it would be worth a few moments of anyone’s time. I myself changed my mind on the question.
[see the later Hate Crime and Subcultures - the debate post.]
This study from Glasgow University in the British Medical Journal is regularly quoted by the media to demonstrate that goth makes peoples self harm.
In fact the article proves nothing of the kind as noted in an article on the report from a scientific source New Scientist:
Even beyond this there are problems with the research itself. The results may actually mean that goths are more ready to admit they have a problem with depression and self harm because the subculture is more tolerant.About half of teenage goths have deliberately harmed themselves or attempted suicide, a new study suggests. But joining the modern subculture – which grew out of the 1980s gothic rock scene – may actually protect vulnerable children, researchers say.
The study followed 1258 young people who were interviewed at ages 11, 13, 15 and 19. It found that of those who considered themselves goths, 53% had self-harmed and 47% had tried to commit suicide. The average prevalence of self-harm among young people in the UK is 7% to 14%. Self-harm includes behaviours such as cutting or burning oneself. And about 6% of young people admit suicide attempts. Some studies suggest the incidence is rising in society.
Researchers at University of Glasgow found that while most self-harmers started the practice at age 12 to 13, they did not become goths until they were a couple of years older, on average.
“One common suggestion is they may be copying subcultural icons or peers [when they self-harm], but our study found that more young people reported self-harm before, rather than after, becoming a goth. This suggests that young people with a tendency to self-harm are attracted to the goth subculture,” says Robert Young, who led the study.
Quick fix
“Rather than posing a risk, it's also possible that by belonging to the goth subculture, young people are gaining valuable social and emotional support from their peers.” But he cautions: “However, the study was based on small numbers and replication is needed to confirm our results.” Only 25 participants felt strongly associated with goth culture.
Self-harming, Young says, is a behaviour that people often employ as a mechanism to deal with negative emotions. “It may be used as a quick-fix. "Some physiological studies suggest, or are compatible with the theory that endorphins [brain chemicals that produce a feeling of well-being] are released after episodes of self-harm," he told New Scientist.
Just 2% of the adolescents in the study identified with goth culture, although 8% said they had identified with it at some point in their lives. But it is a strongly non-violent and accepting subculture, which teens may find offers a supportive environment.
Michael van Beinum, a psychiatrist for children and adolescents, who advised on the study, agrees: “For some young people with mental health problems, a goth subculture may be attractive as it may allow them to find a community within which it may be easier for their distress to be understood.”
The 1980s goth culture grew out of the post-Punk movement and underwent a revival in the mid-1990s. Central to goth belief is the black aesthetic – taking icons that society regards as evil, such as skull imagery, and making them beautiful.
Journal reference: British Medical Journal (vol 332, p 909)
Michelle Phillipov,
Postgraduate Student
Dept of English, University of Adelaide 5005It is somewhat unexpected that BMJ would publish such an article, which attempts to determine traits associated with the Goth subculture—a grouping which potentially comprises of 100,000s adherents globally—based on a sample of only 15 individuals in a single locality.
While Goth subculture is the article focus, just two references are given, and only one of them academic. There is a failure both to consult other pertinent studies—including Wright [1] and Siegel [2]—and to frame the results with respect to existing knowledge. For example, while Young et al’s results show a significant prevalence of males (about 2:1) in the ‘Goth’ category, Hodkinson—the only academic reference on Goth cited by the authors (see Young et al, ref [5])—clearly states that the Goth subculture is comprised of equal numbers of males and females. The reluctance to address this inconsistency with respect to their own cited reference is not only a significant oversight, it also makes it impossible to determine whether the authors’ findings are the result of male over- or female under-identification as Goth, or if they are simply symptomatic of untenable sample size and study design.
In addition, while Young et al find females at risk of attempted suicide, the known suicide rate for the 15-19yr group in 2000 was 4 to 1 with respect to males (see Young et al, ref [1]). Hence, the results directly contradict what is logically expected.
Furthermore, it is notable that members of the Goth subculture practice self-harm almost exclusively by means of cutting, scratching and scoring, and not through more extreme methods such as punching or self- poisoning. However, the authors unwillingness to consider the context(s) in which cutting, scratching and scoring occur, along with their readiness to subsume potentially diverse practices into a single discourse of pathology, makes it impossible to draw conclusions about the meaning and effects of these behaviours for the Goth subculture.
While the authors seek to link cutting, scratching and scoring to depression, attempted suicide and psychiatric illness, these techniques can in fact be practised for a range of different reasons. For example, within some subcultural contexts, these practices are used to induce fine scarring in decorative patterns on the body; that is, they are used as methods of bodily decoration and adornment, much like tattooing or body piercing. Without an understanding of context, it is impossible to determine whether this is the case for the Goth subculture. However, the tendency for medical and mental health discourse to systematically misrecognise body modification as self-mutilation or self-harm has been noted elsewhere [3].
Unfortunately, studies like the current one, which adopts an epidemiological approach to assessing traits within subgroups, habitually seem to support prevailing popular stereotypes. Perhaps this explains the ready acceptance and promulgation of the findings, whilst disregarding the lack of substantiation and generalisability, as well as the serious methodological flaws.
[1] Wright R. I’d sell you suicide: pop music and moral panic in the age of Marilyn Manson. Popular Music 2000; 19: 365-86.
[2] Siegel C. Goth’s dark empire. Bloomington: Indiana University Press, 2005.
[3] Pitts V. Body modification, self-mutilation and agency in media accounts of a subculture. In Body Modification (Ed. Featherstone M). London: Sage, 2000, pp291-303.
Someone else pointed out statistical flaws:
I have enjoyed reading the paper and all responses. Here, there are few "statistical" commments. There seemed to be several flaws in the design and execution of this study.
1. are the results valid?
Authors don't give us clear description of how subjects were identified and recruited. Did they volunteer? How many refused to participate in the study? The researchers could simply have sampled the participants in such a way as to increase the chance of supporting their hypothesis. Cohort should be representative of a true population for study to be valid. Some researches use randomization procedure in cohort studies in order to choose sample, which is the most accurate picture of population.
2. Follow-up/attrition rate.
Follow-up in this study was probably long enough (8years). However, in 1994, there were 2586 participants, whereas by the year 2002/04 only 1258. Could those followed-up be a biased sample? Loss of participants may effect precision and power of the study. For example, in Table 3 under Model 1 Goth subculture there is wide confidence interval (4,42 to 45,39), which may point out to undepowered study (type II error).
3. Observer Bias?
Outcomes have been assesed using Voice-DISC. Participants were asked varies questions on: suicide, self-harm, identification with subculture. It is not mentioned how raters conducted the interviews, whether they used structured or semi-structured protocol, whether they were blind to the study's hypothesis. The more subjective rating is, the more important blinding becomes. The bias introduced by non-blinding is likely to overestimate findings. It seems that a decision of belonging to one subculture or another was rather subjective (participants' responses were assessed on a five point scale). All in all, no blinding, lack of structured interview, subjectivity can lead to observer bias.
4. Confounders
Reseachers did adjust for some confounders (sex, social class, etc) using logistic regression. However, as somebody has already pointed out, the list of potential confounding factors is long, inc physical illness, obesity, family hx.
5. Results
For prospective studies outcomes are best presented as a relative risk.One can comment then on prevalence or incidence of the disorder. In this study authors use odds ratio.
6. Study's applicability
Is this study applicable in different subcultures? Probably not. In Table 3, which shows relationship between self-harm and type of subculture, majotiry of results are statistically non-significant.
In conclusion,
In cohort studies a group of individuals is followed-up over a period of time. The individuals should be free of the outcome (here: self- harm/attempted suicide)at the beginning of follow-up. The cohort is defined by exposure status(here: Goth subculture), which should be found out before outcome is known. Cohort study measures whether exposure effects the incidence/prevalence of the outcome,i.e. whether identification with Goth subculture increases the risk of self-harm or/and suicide. Researches believe that yes. By reading and critically analysing this study, I have arrived at different conclusions.
The authors reply is interesting:
We were pleased that our paper generated a wide variety of comments. While some contributors raised specific points, others referred to more general issues relating to issues of definition, explanations and generalisability.
The definition of “Goth” is contentious, but covers a wide range of musical tastes, social groupings, and aesthetics. The most relevant distinction here is between contemporary (usually younger) “Baby, Bat or sometimes referred to as Mall (US)” Goths vs. “mature, real or Elder Goths” 1. Our paper, as is clear from the title, refers to younger Goths; the results may not apply to all Goths.
The range of comments in response to our conclusion, that both selection and influence mechanisms may be involve, reflect the lack of evidence on this issue. To highlight this, we drew attention in the press release following publication to the possibility that engagement with Goth subculture could have positive rather than negative consequences for some young people. Our contribution is a first step towards producing an evidence base to test this, rather than relying on media speculation.
Some contributors have suggested that the association between self- harm and Goth subculture may be accounted for by other factors. However this is unlikely, since we adjusted for the strongest and most relevant correlates of self-harm found in other studies of young people. Others have suggested that our results were not valid due to the small numbers involved. We would point out that our paper underwent a formal statistical review before publication. Further, while the media focused on the 25 young people who unambiguously identified as Goth, nearly 8% of our representative sample had identified with Goth subculture, in varying degrees of intensity, and were 3-4 times more likely to self-harm, than the other participants.
It has also been suggested that by adopting a quantitive approach we may have missed contextual factors (this is obviously true of any non- qualitative study), and that the high rate of self-harm found among Goths is a form of decoration, analogous to body modification. We dispute this on two grounds. Firstly, since those who self-harmed were asked why, we know that the majority, regardless of youth subculture did so to relieve anxiety, anger and other negative emotions. Secondly, while cutting could be interpreted as some form of subcultural display, such an argument is difficult to sustain in relation to attempted suicide.
Sadly as I will show in a later post the media ignored the authors intentions with the notable exception of the New Scientist.
edmontonsun.com - Edmonton News - 'We're not killers'
In the United states following Columbine many schools instituted dress codes outlawing gothic fashions. Now in Florida one school has revised the code: The Brevard County School Board tweaked its dress code policy to remove the word "Gothic" this week. That was a judicious move. No other group of students is listed in the policy. Hip-hop and jock styles also break the dress code, but their groups aren't singled out for censure by name. Branding Goths as somehow dangerous was unfair and unneeded. But some Goth kids dislike school dress code restrictions -- such as bans on facial piercings and heavy makeup -- and petitioned the board to ease them. The board correctly said no, and Brevard schools will continue to prohibit piercings anywhere but the ear, and extreme make-up. The dress code also rightly forbids clothing or accessories with violent, death-oriented or sexually aggressive themes, gang-related items, dog collars, and other styles that can be disruptive in the classroom.
The new ruling allows goths a bit more freedom of expression. This followed a campaign by local goth pupils at Rockledge High. This is a fine example of a committed campaign organised intelligently on a local level to fight against pure prejudice which has won a small but significant triumph, in that they will be able to wear gothic items that do not break the code. The group continue their campaign. Baggy pants associated with rap and hip-hop are also banned in the school.
If there is no general uniform policy for a school then children should be free to wear what they want within reason. Sportswear indicates certain gangs as much as anything else. As is now known the Columbine killers did not follow gothic fashions nor were they part of the subculture in general. If simply wearing black makes you a goth someone should tell the Church. It is interesting Columbine was mentioned in the article showing how deeply the media coverage took root.
Gordon Crews, a professor at Washburn University in Topeka, Kan., who specializes in Gothic subculture studies and criminal justice said:
"There's so much misperception and miscommunication that it leads to hysteria," he said. "Just because kids are wearing black or a facial piercing, we automatically attach that to disruptive behavior when most the time these kids are well behaved."
Interestingly one of the pupils claimed her goth clothes were part of her Wiccan spirituality.
Want to write songs about death ? Don't do it in Seattle because some parents will get up a petition like they did against local goth/deathrock band Schoolyard Heroes.
"We are a group of upset parents who are trying to stop a tragedy before it begins, and that tragedy is Schoolyard Heroes," the online petition read. "It has been brought to our attention that there is a cult of young children, ONLY 13 YEARS OLD in some cases, following this band around and running away from home. This must be stopped."
"They are evil! They want to corrupt our children and drive them to murder with their fascination with the dark and evil world of Satan!"
In an interview the band discuss the problem:The oldest and strongest emotion of mankind is fear, and the oldest and strongest kind of fear is fear of the unknown. Alterophobia is the term for fear and hatred of the Other, which is Fear of the the Strange, the Unknown. This hatred of the Other, is the basis for all kinds of fears and hatreds: hatred of foreigners, hatred of those of a different sexuality or gender, hatred of those of a different religion, hatred of the disabled, or hatred of the young or old. To fight against these prejudices to respect other people and to tolerate diversity is a keystone of modern Western society.
One area of intolerance which is little appreciated is the lack of respect shown towards members of alternative subcultures across the world. So I think alterophobia is a convient term to use describe this kind of prejudice. Often these subcultures arose in youth movements, but with time they have grown to become permanent part of the diverse web of organisations and people which make up modern life. These groups have frequently become targets of moral panics, their members turned into folk devils responsible for all the ills of society. Exaggeration, distortion and prejudice have made them convenient media scapegoats for tragedies like the Columbine shooting (see Columbine - The Legacy of Hatred ). These media distortions then support and reinforce existing prejudices.
Subcultural groups from hippies, punks, metalers, goths, skaters, emos, mods, rockers, New Age travellers, ravers and others all have suffered from these perceptions. As a result members of these subcultures often feel isolated and under attack. They receive not just verbal abuse but even physical violence which this blog has documentated in a number of posts There have always been those who are ready to turn to violence because of prejudice, ready to attack those who seem different. It is particularly bad for teenagers in school who are bullied simply because they listen to a different kind of music or dress alternatively. Many of the reports we have dealt with underline that school is a key location in these problems. Yes indeed some members of subcultural groups are criminals, or indulge in bad behaviour, but the extent of this is exaggerated along with other media distortions simply because it is easy to pick on them as scapegoats rather than o explore the complex social issues surrounding problems like violence, suicide and self-harm. There are cases like the West Memphis Three where being part of subculture has led to a miscarriage of justice and has further blackened the reputation of the subcultures involved. The vast majority of members of these groups are law abiding citizens of wherever they live. Indeed they often unnoticed perform good deeds. We must not forget to condemn equally the long-standing rivalries amongst subcultures, which when taken to extremes support exactly the sort of hatred and prejudice we are against. These feelings have contributed to violence in Mexico against emos for example.
I believe that this prejudice against these subcultures feed into creating a wider sphere of discrimination and hatred. If you cannot tolerate someone from the same nation as you, but who has a different hair style what chance is there you can tolerate other differences? By teaching tolerance for everyone we can create a better society.
This blog was motivated by the death of Sophie Lancaster, only twenty years old but murdered because she choose to dress in a goth style in August 2007. Yet Sophie's death is only part of a wider wave of prejudice which chooses to attack or abuse members of subcultures simply for the crime of existing and going about their daily lives. Look at the earlier case of the death of American punk Brian Deneke in 1997 in Amarillo, Texas for another example. Ten years on the case of Brian Deneke's death still arouses deep feelings amongst punks but there is no sign the issues of school and teen divisions it highlighted have been dealt with.
If Columbine High School had solved in 1999 the similar social divisions between jocks and alternative people in their school, exactly the sam divisions as there had been at Amarillo, would lives have been saved?
In the UK the death of Sophie has resulted in a Epetition at Downing Street website against Subcultural Hate Crime which is drawing attention to the issues and created a debate. This led to a poltical movement which may lead to a change in the law in the UK see post on the Early Day Motion.
Are these attacks at the same level as in earlier periods or are they getting worse? Without statistics it is difficult to say. Certainly it might seem we are just seeing what is an age old story but if you take the example of the fight which ended with the death of Dele Little that gives you two deaths as a result of subcultural differences amongst teenagers in the UK in 2007. There are worrying indications the problem may be getting worse. Since starting this blog I have documented a number of attacks and other issues which have effected emos, goths, punk, followers of Heavy Metal and skaters.
This blog will try to keep track of these problems, in the UK and across the world, and by highlighting them hopefully go some way to showing the problem exists and start to combat them.
